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Ok, round 2 - ASCN Deficiencies

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Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 15:11:00 - [1] K .. Lord X1v welcome to centre stage. First of all.. what are your credentials? Who are you? Do you have a record of combat? perhaps with another alt, if so pls provide details. Only an active combatant can stand where you are standing and say the things you are saying with any moral highground. Secondly... you are not revealing a whole lot about ASCN that isn't already common knowledge. Your thread is actually pretty tame... but there is one thing that is very interesting. You say ASCN CEO's and corporations including CYVOK have already packed up the family silver and packed it off to empire.. this in time of war is tantamount to treason. Do you have any proof of this? Its a semi-interesting thread but without the information I have pointed out, its not very exciting.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 15:38:00 - [2] Edited by: Nez Perces on 17/12/2006 15:42:12 Originally by: Lord XSiV Yes I do have a record for combat. It would be with alts though :( . In fact, if you will peruse the Edf forums you will see I got named most improved pvp'er for the month of August. Not that I consider that a boasting accomplishment, but it is there to answer your question. I'm afraid thats not good enough.. who are your alts?.. so that the record of combat can be checked, your most active combat alt will suffice. Originally by: Lord Xsiv Proof is something that can be disputed as we have seen time and time again on these forums. Photoshopping pics, TS recordings, etc it has all be done. So I ask you this, please define what non-repudiation evidence would be deemed acceptable and I would have to tell you that ther eis no such thing as non-repudiation in this game. Regardless, it doesn't matter, if they don't want to take the info, then so be it, it is their loss. Again not good enough.... you must have chatlogs of CEO's/directors talking of transferring valuables to empire. You spoke of STK Scientific using their road trip to fountain as a cover for shipping valuables out of ASCN space. You spoke of CYVOK actually skimming 10% of ASCN earnings over the last years and stashing it away in empire. There must be chatlogs, internal directorial postings... anything, which ASCN would then have to disprove. You cannot then say that there is no proof of this.. because then you are guilty of exactly what ASCN have been doing by accusing BoB/CCP etc... of haxxors. What you have posted so far is in no way shape or form worth actually ratting on your former alliance mates. There is a word for that, its called a traitor. The onus is on you to provide proof of what you are saying.. otherwise the above label will be all you are left with.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 16:35:00 - [3] Originally by: Lord XSiV No sorry, I won't reveal them here on the forum. It does nothing but allow for future intelligence gathering.... Then you don't have a leg to stand on. Originally by: Lord XsiV As for your other calls to provide 'evidence', well I will just let time provide that. This is a game, so just leave it at that as it isn't worth the effort much more than I have put into this. Maybe you should be asking them for evidence that all those assets are not up in empire on some non-descript alt....Afterall wasn't that which was asked in the TS hacking claim thread by ASCN? Bob was supposed to provide proof that it wasn't them? It is ok for ASCN to have others prove their 'innocence' but it doesn't apply to them? And were the baseless accusations of ASCN not laughed out of town for being unsubstantiated? You know what they say don't you.. "Proof or STFU" You are doing exactly what ASCN did, via people like Malachon countless others... baseless accusations with no proof. Originally by: Lord XsiV Lots of interesting discussion points... Actually no, there isn't anything interesting to discuss from what you have posted.. its not possible to discuss conjectures and random accusations. You won't even reveal your combat character.. I mean whats the point? Your words carry as much weight as some random alt picked off the pavements of Jita. If this is all you have to bring to the table.. it might be time to exit centre stage now, btw duck 'cause rotten tomatoes don't wash off too good. Dare I say it.. post with your main.. your combat main that is, if you indeed have one.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 16:41:00 - [4] Originally by: Lord XSiV Could it be possible that I was bringing up things into question that were too sensitive for HC to answer as the answers to those questions could have finished off the rest of morale? I mean afterall, most people would leave if they knew that their corp reserves were sitting on an ooc alt in empire instead of being used for the war. Proof.. combat character.. provide now.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 16:44:00 - [5] Originally by: Lord XSiV From my understanding it isn't worth much anyhow. Aha.. flames now... I'm not accusing anybody of anything now am I? I have nothing to prove.. but you do. Its a shame I was looking forward to this thread.... it turned out to be quite disappointing.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 17:55:00 - [6] Edited by: Nez Perces on 17/12/2006 17:57:42 Originally by: Niraco79 Dear sir drake , i know lord during my time in EDF. U should not talk about what u don`t know. I really do not agree of how is he takin his frustrations into these forums, but please do not say uninformed posts. he has at least 2-3 alts in edf, his main is a frickin miner. his primary alt is pvp. If u really wanna know just ask edf leadership like genrom his pvp wing leader and u will get better informations. K... now we are getting somewhere... somebody is prepared to vouch for Lord XsiV. Hunters Agency is a FIX corp, and I'm going to assume this is your main... as is Herculite a main from the same corp. Perhaps some of Lord Xsiv's credibility can be restored. Niraco79.. it would seem that you know the name of Lord Xsiv's combat character... you could chose to do a check on that character on the ASCN killboards and give an approx. combat record over the last 3 months. You don't need to reveal the name of the character just the combat record. Lord Xsiv is saying some pretty big things about ASCN CEO's and Cyvok stashing minerals in empire in preparation for ASCN's fall... he needs some backup. This thread got quite ugly for him.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 18:17:00 - [7] Edited by: Nez Perces on 17/12/2006 18:18:10 Originally by: Niraco79 nez...just look on eve-defence.com forums in public section u will find your informations if u really need them.. look on about you thread on his signature and u will see his 3 alts(except) all from EDF I'm looking can't find nothing though.. give me a hint.... Originally by: Niraco79 btw lord was and still is a miner. he started pvp while edf trip to north around august. but if is a miner does not imply he has no right to talk and issue his opinions. I bet u did not killed so many bistot roids as he did, but his help in this area is not marked on any killboards. If u will search ascn killboards u will see Niraco, even is my main, has not a uber stat. But i think u met my alt (who has more sp than my main) and "her" stas ate in ascn killboard like 40 kills to 1 loss. u should know better that killboards stats doeas not make the man behind the screen and his abilities. Well Niraco79, for the purposes of Lord Xsiv having some moral highground to stand on for this thread.. he needs to have a combat record, or else he could be one of the very people he is complaining about. No combat record for the purposes of this thread means no high horse to ride. Besides.. if there are pilots in ASCN that still havent fired a shot in this war, they need to be kicked out.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 18:45:00 - [8] Edited by: Nez Perces on 17/12/2006 18:48:12 Originally by: Niraco79 nez i do not agree with u about combat records...do u really think cyvok had a great combat record? now i hate myself to make your forum job easier for you link to edf- public boards lord xsiv about him statement - don`t search for mine :D Cheers mate.. k.. so one of Lord Xsiv's characters has indeed been fighting and participated on 5 kills and suffered 7 losses amongst them 2 BS. K its not an outstanding contribution.. but its something.. and if you add to that some work as a covert ops pilot and any mining work?..then there is a semblance of a combat record and active particpation in alliance affairs. I think its fair to say that Lord Xsiv is not a leech.. at least not a terrible one. He has therefore got a right to complain. Now for the real meat in this thread.. the fact that ASCN CEO's and possibly CYVOK have already given up on ASCN and have started packing bags for empire. Well.. if we check this thread...EDF restucturing blog.. suddenly what Lord Xsiv is saying becomes entirely more plausible. Whaddya know... huh? Xsiv, sure you haven't got some more juicy posts, blogs, chatlogs .. that might clinch this for you?
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 19:00:00 - [9] Originally by: Niraco79 look on other alt dear nez...is like 30 to 11 ...be nice :P ..but as i repeat not one good killboard stat will make u a good person and a good team mate heh.. i thought id checked them all must have missed one.. anwyays... I think the point can be conceded. Lord XsiV did his bit.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 19:03:00 - [10] Originally by: Omatje But he isn't suffering at all, he's either hiding in empire or hiding in a station, wondering what is really happening outside, and his only source of intel are forums or alliance chat I'm sorry but that angle doesn't work anymore.. Lord XsiV has a combat record, i.e he fought BoB, killed and lost ships for the cause, as would be expected from a pilot in an alliance during time of war. So he hasn't been hiding.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 19:15:00 - [11] Originally by: Mi Lai So dear Lord, Hasn't it occured to you that maybe when EDF posted: Quote: EDF is going to undergo a transformation. We're going to downsize ourself and change our priorities towards the central theme of having fun. That downsizing was aimed to getting rid of people like you? Thats not the point.. the point is that the EDF blog implies that EDF is getting ready for ASCN's demise.... and if that is the case... it is quite possible that corp assets are getting shipped out to safety. And thats not even the most worrying thing for ASCN.... EDF as a backbone corp and John McReedy as a a member of the HC help in setting the tone for the alliance. What Lord Xsiv has been saying is that EDF CEO's/Directors are not the only ones looking out for number one.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 19:20:00 - [12] Originally by: Omatje And what combat record would that be? that he lost 1 ship+pod and then ran away? Nope.. his alts have been checked out by an independent source... there is a combat record of at least 30 participations and losses, + covert ops work + the guy is actually primarily a miner. His story checks out at least on the participation front... the other part of the story is dependent on further proof, but the EDF Blog would indicate that it is quite plausible.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 20:11:00 - [13] Originally by: Malachon Draco Wth are you smoking? All I am doing is asking what the standard is for having a 'combat record'? Is 30 kills a combat record? That's a joke. The combat record issue, was simply one of establishing a basic level of participation... with the aim of determining wether the OP had at least some basic credibility. I don't know what constitutes a combat record in ASCN.... its a relative thing and can only be judged in reference to the rest of your alliance. Its not really the point. You have a better combat record than Lord Xsiv, but he may well have a better combat record than a lot of pilots in ASCN. I don't know. Its not the point. Lord Xsiv has participated.. that much is clear, wether in combat (limited perhaps), covertops or industrial work. There is no reason to doubt him on that front. Now as for the other issue of CEO's potentially preparing to jump ship... there has been no evidence brought forward, but I can't help the feeling that with EDF's restucturing blog we may be seeing the beginning of an internal meltdown within ASCN ranks. Tbh I'm very surprised that the new ASCN boss, Virtuozzo has not made a formal announcent on the EVE-O boards stating that ASCN is going to stand firm and hold its ground against BoB.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 20:36:00 - [14] Edited by: Nez Perces on 17/12/2006 20:37:01 Originally by: Mariko San If an alliance leader needs to come to these boards to play to the peanut gallery then things have got a a very sad state. Those that need to know the state of affairs are aware of the state of affairs I am sure. How many people do you ever see come to these forums and leave people with a better impression of them than before they posted? It depends very much on how important you think the EVE-O forums are. Alliances with any sense will recognise their importance. In this conflict the forums have proven to be a crucial element of warfare. It has been a very public war if you like. So far Cyvok has resigned, without a formal post from the man himself.. instead Gungankllr had to do it. Virtuozzo has taken the reigns and I don't think I've seen him post a full sentence yet, he does like to post pictures though, which are actually fairly amusing. Point is all we see from ASCN on these boards is whining, leaked blogs/forum posts and responses to BoB's forum posts usually with a mocking tone. I think it would do ASCN the world of good if they could reclaim some serious forum presence by showing a united front behind their new leader, indicating a break from the old and a new start, albeit on the backfoot. The image an alliance projects to the outside world reflects back onto them and has an internal effect. Its never too late, to turn things around.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 20:55:00 - [15] Originally by: Dragerest Nez Perces, quick question. why do you post in every thread. it is a honest question. did the wife or boyfriend kick you in the balls that hard, and told you the more you post on the forums the faster they will heal? the subject could be about psychology and soon you will be talking about how freud was the father of it and, along with your sing and dance about he's theories of the consciousness, sexuality, and instincts. all you do is try to put effort into people wanting to think you are so full of wisdom. when in fact you just troll the forums like a hooker looking for her next ***** fix. must be lonely being you when all you have is the refresh button on the forums. please troll some more ps. i'm posting in a BoB thread err.. cause its fun?... glad you are enjoying yourself too... or not. Perhaps unplugging your keyboard will help.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 21:14:00 - [16] Originally by: Trytonx Explain to me Xsiv how you stay in 0.0 10 months and lose 1 FRACKING APOC?!?!? I was in 0.0 3 days before my first kills (plural) So im wondering why someone of no worth such as yourself feels so important as to make such a large, yet utterly worthless contribution. Do you know what pvp is? did you lose that apoc on accident and ask yourself " what was that!?" You can sit here on the forums and flap your gums for page upon page while the verbal diahreah just spews out but when push comes to shove your one of those "dockers" and your frankly ****poor KB data will confirm that. 1 Apocalypse BS and your the new backseat alliance driver? I dont think so. Sit down, enjoy empire and if you want some help learning how to load a gun, or even open fire please drop me a line. Enjoy the Jita queue I think you need to read the rest of the thread.... his other characters have been checked out and there are in the region of 30 participations including losses. Whilst not a huge amount it is quite possibly better than the ASCN average over the period of this particular war, but I don't think anybody knows what the ASCN average is.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 21:23:00 - [17] Edited by: Nez Perces on 17/12/2006 21:25:13 Originally by: Darkstar BP Nez, Could you indicate who checked out his other characters, so we know who the reliable source is? That way we can evaluate the reliability of those participation numbers you are floating here. well here is what has been posted so far... Originally by: niraco97, ex-ASCN now in Hunters Agency, FIX .......his primary alt is pvp. If u really wanna know just ask edf leadership like genrom his pvp wing leader and u will get better informations...... look on other alt dear nez...is like 30 to 11 ...be nice :P ..but as i repeat not one good killboard stat will make u a good person and a good team mate and Originally by: Jonathan Fisher, Galactic Security I can vouch for Lord XSiV's combat record. I contacted him ingame and he agreed to provide me with evidence that his alts have a combat record with ASCN, provided I do not reveal those alts. I cannot vouch for his claims about corp assets being moved. This is something that we have to let time tell, and give or take credibility from Lord later. Also I checked one of his alts on the BoB killboards and there were records of participation. Besides, if you look on the EDF forums you will see some of Lord Xsiv's posts where his sig contains further leads.. you can work those out yourself.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 21:40:00 - [18] Originally by: Trytonx Wow, still a pretty shabby record. Behind all your ego bolstering I think we can agree ASCN is better off without dead weight like yourself. And for the record, Syncore is doing just grand, tyvm. The combat record given is nothing to boast about.. that much is for sure.... but, its not actually the point. Point is that he has enough participations to lend him the minimum credibility needed to make his post. Unfortunately the EDF blog leaked today helps to corroborate his statements about ASCN CEO's potentially preparing to jump ship because if you read through it till the end it speaks of the distinct possiblity of ASCN giving up the ghost.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 22:20:00 - [19] Originally by: Apollo Balthar Originally by: Nez Perces Originally by: Lord XSiV Could it be possible that I was bringing up things into question that were too sensitive for HC to answer as the answers to those questions could have finished off the rest of morale? I mean afterall, most people would leave if they knew that their corp reserves were sitting on an ooc alt in empire instead of being used for the war. Proof.. combat character.. provide now. Repeating the same point more often doesn't make it more or less value. You made your point, STFU. mmm... maybe you wanna keep up with the thread... that was many many hours ago... we have now moved onto greater and better things ^^
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.12.17 22:41:00 - [20] Originally by: Apollo Balthar Originally by: Nez Perces I think its fair to say that Lord Xsiv is not a leech.. at least not a terrible one. He has therefore got a right to complain. Thank you, oh holy, one that you have set that straight for us mere mortals.... You are welcome. Now stop whining.

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